Help On The Way For Striking Hawker Beechcraft Machinists
Help On The Way For Striking Hawker Beechcraft Machinists Save Email Print
Reporter: KAKE News
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Wichita Machinists on strike against Hawker Beechcraft are getting help feeding their families.

Volunteers packaed up boxes of food for striking machinists today.
Each worker will get a bag of groceries that's enough to feed a family of four. The food will be handed out once a week until the strike ends. "Every little bit helps... it helps us become united and be stronger and let the company know we're all together, stick together so we can get what we want," said Tywanna Thompson.

Machinists in Wichita and Salina walked off the job on August 4th. No new talks have been scheduled between HBC and the Machinists Union.

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Posted by: Grandpa's Wife Location: Wichita on Aug 25, 2008 at 11:19 PM
Read new contract & saw some good changes. Have a couple of questions though. Contract states "premiums" are not going to increase for life of contract. But read 22.09.01 "Effective 01-09 other selected provisions of the HBC Group Life, Medical, Disability Benefit Plans, Dental & Vision Plans will be revised as agreed between the parties as noted in the 2009 group benefits Summaries. The Company agrees to notify the union at least 30 days in advance of any changes in medical carriers or claims administrator". What are these revisions & where are they listed? Are deductibles & co-pays going up? If these increase, there goes a portion of your 4% increase. I don't understand all the legalese but I would like to know ALL the facts up front. I looked thru contract but didn't see the "summaries" they said to see for details. Thanks for any help. Strikers, I am proud of your conviction and the fact that you stood up for what you believe in!
Posted by: Oldphart Location: At a Gate on Aug 25, 2008 at 12:28 AM
Cop Mom: Those that have no idea of what was in prior contracts to be able to compare to the contract that was rejected, have not walked in our shoes, and are mostly wanting to vent....and they do so here. Some become educated, and understand the position taken by so many that voted to strike. That does not mean they agree, but with knowledge comes understanding and tolerance. Those that either will not or cannot understand will post the same comments without ever thinking about how they portray themselves to the public. I think you have a lot of patience and admire you for your diligent efforts.
Posted by: Cop Mom Location: Wichita on Aug 24, 2008 at 10:37 PM
Grandma, I agree that some union workers are mediocre, same as some non-union members, same as some management. The reason for a union is to protect its members from unfair management practices. If companies treated their employees fairly on their own, we wouldn't need unions. You keep saying that the contract was fair. What is fair about giving raises and then raising our insurance costs more than the raises? Also, can you honestly believe the attendence policies for new hires are fair? My teenage daughter works at Wendy's part-time. Even as an unskilled worker, she doesn't get fired for missing time if she is sick or there is an emergency. You keep harping on all the "company gives" but don't mention even one take away. As has been said many times before, the strike is about more than just raises. I agree with Grandpa's Wife, you seem to be in possession of more facts on the contract than others on this site, so please share as maybe I am misinformed.
Posted by: Granpa's Wife Location: Wichita on Aug 24, 2008 at 10:21 PM
To Anonymous: What department are you a manager in? If you truly know what is going on, as you say you do, you must be on the inside. But then you say "From what I heard" which makes me think you either are not an employee at all or just a company person trying to stir up trouble. If you are not an employee or a family member of an employee, why do you care? As I said before, if the strikers and family members of strikers annoy you so much, stay off the site, don't listen to the news ect. In other words, get a life. If you have something constructive to say, whether pro or con, fine, but to me you just sound like you really don't know anything but just want to stir up trouble. And I really appreciate your concern for my bills, but don't worry, we saved for this strike and my bills are getting paid. And the $150.00 per week does help. Again, thank you for your concern. Stay strong strikers! ONE MORE DAY!!
Posted by: Anonymous on Aug 23, 2008 at 08:58 AM
Ya great there is somebody here to sit and try and help get everybody a contract but ha nothing is happening yet and here comes week four. Week for also meens the first of the month I hope you can all pay your bills with that $150. This is a joke. Nobody is winning and the more that go back the less that are on the lines. I have read of people having to get other jobs to help pay the bills to they cannot be out there on the lines. What happen to all the noise you guys were making four weeks ago. Four people is not showing anybody anything it is just letting more people go back to work and pretty soon they will hit that 51%. So lets see who wins in the end. From what I have heard things are going just fine inside. Maybe not as fast as they would like but they are moving the only ones hurting are those on strike. Have fun and you lose more and more.
Posted by: Grandpa's Wife Location: Wichita on Aug 22, 2008 at 06:41 PM
Grandma: I did not get to read the contract so, as a worker's wife, I would like to know what the contract offered and took away. You seem to have all the info on the contract so please share. Thanks.
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 22, 2008 at 03:58 PM
I don't understand how offering a contract that includes more than one hundred million of additional costs over three years is a sign of disrespect.
Posted by: !!! Location: ict on Aug 22, 2008 at 02:41 PM
No he might not have called ugly names, BUT he says (by his actions) he doesn't think the employees are worth anything. To him ALL of the employees are a thorn in his side so he can't get a BIGGER BONUS.
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 21, 2008 at 04:52 AM
Cop Mom -- Don't know how you got the idea that EITHER side of my mouth is pro-union! That would certainly not be true. In my opinion, the union encourages mediocrity. Despite the fact that everyone who's ever had a child knows that you want to reward good behavor and punish bad, when the union contract says so, everyone gets exactly the same percentage raise. So what incentive does that provide to try to do a better job than the guy next to you? And don't even get me started on the abuse people have had to endure just to get to work during the strike. Your son should review the incident reports about vandalism, name-calling, and threats submitted during the strike. I'm not related to Jim Schuster, but if I had to pick, I'd sure rather be related to him than those screaming people I've seen on the picket lines. So far as I know, Schuster has been coming to work every day, doing the job he signed on to do, and hasn't called any of his co-workers ugly names.
Posted by: Cop Mom Location: Wichita on Aug 20, 2008 at 09:23 PM
My husband has been in contact with an employee inside and she has not heard of any vandalism. This person is in management so I don't think she would hide that fact as she is not in favor of the strike. My son is a Wichita police officer and he said to his knowledge the strike has been very peaceful with no reports of property damage or vandalism. What are you putting in your cookies, Grandma? Sour grapes?? Sounds to me that with one side of your mouth you are pro-union but really are just spreading anti-union hype. Are you sure you are related to Shuster?
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 20, 2008 at 04:49 PM
I wouldn't lie to you, and am in a position to know about the incidents. The auto body shops will have a lot of painting to do. And the insurance companies are going to be coming after those who did the damage, as they should. Pretty poor thinking to key the car of someone who is in the same department -- they'll recognize you!
Posted by: News Update on Aug 20, 2008 at 04:21 PM
Per IAM website and radio news, HBC and the Union will be meeting with a Federal mediator. One more day!!
Posted by: # on Aug 20, 2008 at 01:58 PM
Really Grandma?? I've heard alot of things but I hadn't heard that and I know someone crossing. They said that things seem to be pretty peaceful for it being a strike, where their at. Hasn't noticed any big problems with the strikers at all.
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 20, 2008 at 11:22 AM
There has been a LOT of car vandalism, threats, and bad behavior -- especially toward female employees. Too bad police reports aren't generally available to the public. No need for me to heat the oven yet.
Posted by: my grandmas not like that on Aug 20, 2008 at 07:36 AM
Ok granny, get to baking. There hasn't been any of that going on. Maybe an isolated instance. Where's your corroboration for your story?
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 19, 2008 at 09:39 PM
I suspect that HBC did not want to issue a business update so soon after Mr. Hart's death. They probably thought it would not be respectful at this time, and wanted people to instead think about him and his poor bereaved family.
Posted by: 819 Location: plant 4 on Aug 19, 2008 at 07:46 PM
where's week 2 update ??????????????????????
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 19, 2008 at 05:42 PM
I'd be very happy if my grandkids (when they are old enough) were to become employees of HBC. I'll admit I'm not a big fan of the conduct the Union members have been demonstrating lately, but wouldn't say that is the equivalent of hate. Heck, if they'd stop keying cars, throwing rocks, and making death threats, I'd even bake them some cookies! After they did a "time out" and apologized sincerely, of course.
Posted by: my grandmas not like that on Aug 19, 2008 at 04:37 PM
You're not the nicey-nice grandma you claim to be. I've read your posts and you say things that show that you don't love the union. Opposite of love=hate. Besides, you and I are the only ones on this website. I'm sure you're a nice grandma.
Posted by: my grandmas not like that on Aug 19, 2008 at 04:29 PM
Grandma! You're back! Hey Grandma, how about your grandkids? When they grow up and say (God forbid) they go to work for HBC. It could happen. Wouldn't you want them to have good benefits and a decent wage?
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 19, 2008 at 03:57 PM
What hate? I said I'm not Jim Schuster's wife (never met the man), that the FAA website doesn't support the rumors that lines have been shut down, and that the IAM doesn't seem to provide any impartial corroboration for the rumors it seems to be spreading. Didn't call anyone names, didn't question anyone's intelligence, didn't criticize anyone's grammar or spelling. Sounds pretty factual to me!
Posted by: STRIKEPROUD Location: Wichita on Aug 19, 2008 at 01:24 PM
I pray for our fallen union brother, you will be missed. Man the turn out we had was awesome, I am proud to be on strike and stand up for what I believe in. For you select few that type your hate, keep it up it only makes us stonger. I am ready to go back to a nice clean work area that the scabs are cleaning for us, thanks a lot SCABS. I bet managers are mad as *%$$ having to try and do our job, (key word here is try.)
Posted by: HBC STRIKER Location: Wichita on Aug 19, 2008 at 10:28 AM
We are hearing so much from inside the plants and it is not good... Scrapping parts, cleaning and painting is what is going on in there. Well, I guess maybe we will have CLEANER working conditions when we come back! I am proud of the new employees I see sticking it out with us. As important as video games are to some men, i saw a new employee with his little baby in his arms selling his video game system to stick it out with us. This is about way more than money. Those who don't understand, well, can't do anything for you, maybe someday you will. This is one of those times in life when you choose a road and it may not be the easier road, but you know it is the right one. STAY STRONG HBC STRIKERS!!!
Posted by: my grandma's not like that on Aug 19, 2008 at 06:57 AM
OK, it's a new day. Time to quit mourning and get back to grandmas "hate" comments. Come on grandma, you're on!
Posted by: Grandpa's Wife Location: Wichita on Aug 18, 2008 at 10:18 PM
To Jeff Hart's family and friends: Please accept our deepest sympathy and prayers.
Posted by: Dave Location: wichita on Aug 18, 2008 at 09:52 PM
Mark Bush - I can certainly understand where you're coming from but you have the wrong kind of selfish attitude. Your angle is that you want a paycheck.. NOW. You should think about everything else that comes with that paycheck that can make your life a living hell with HBC. I've seen newbies all excited to start on HBC earlier this year thinking only of the overtime. They ended up quiting after a few months because they couldn't handle the stress. This contract is even worse. Think about it.
Posted by: * on Aug 18, 2008 at 05:30 PM
To HBC Striker: I can't believe someone would actually do that!!! Not calling you a liar or anything, I'm just so shocked at the behavior of that individual. Whether a person supports the strike or not, there is no room or right to act like that. That is so lame considering the loss of your fellow union member today. Even still, that is really childish. I'm sure that someday he'll wish he hadn't done that. When grows up and gets some maturity and someone treats him the same way. That's KARMA, it will come back and bite him in the rear!!! You can count on it!!!! I'm so sorry you had to deal with that, especially today, of all days!!!!! Peace to you and your family.
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 18, 2008 at 04:32 PM
to HBC Striker -- Nope.
Posted by: HBC STRIKER Location: Greenwich Rd on Aug 18, 2008 at 02:09 PM
To the little short boy in the black car at the plant 4 gate, flashing your paycheck to the strikers. I hope it was worth it to you when so many are sacrificing for better. I will not forget your laughing/ scowling face as you danced your paycheck to all the strikers down Greenwich. You are one of those people that don't have a clue and never will. I am sorry for you. You may have got a paycheck, but that is all you have. Stand strong strikers and don't let "FOOLS" bring you down.
Posted by: Anonymous on Aug 18, 2008 at 01:03 PM
Somebody died today can't we all take a break. Stop a pray for both families and then tomorrow start back at eachother. Now that man cannot say one more day because his one more day is up. So why you are all fighting with eachother think about that. And I will stop and pray for both families for they are both a mess today and they do not have tomorrow. May god be with them.
Posted by: Oldphart on Aug 18, 2008 at 09:22 AM
To annonymous: Bless you and your husband. It is actions like those you speak of that were part of the work ethic for everyone, not just the few as we have now. By the words spoken here by so many, the idea of building the aircraft per the drawings is not a familiar one. To those who speak of aircraft going out, please be aware that you are reponsible for the lives and welfare for each and every person that flies aboard that craft. Those replacements doing the work now should be able to build the aircraft by drawing requirements alone. That is a "best case" scenario, reality speaks a differently. What is more worrying now that the strike drags on is the unwillingness of the company to recognize the impact that the lack of skill and knowledge of those building the planes during strike. I am sure that their projected risk analysis showed a rosy outlook since they no longer consider accuracy of workmanship a factor.
Posted by: HBC STRIKER Location: Wichita on Aug 18, 2008 at 08:38 AM
Grandma... Are you Mr Schuster's wife?????
Posted by: ur_strong Location: wichita on Aug 18, 2008 at 08:01 AM
hang tight my brothers and sisters,been in all strikes since 85 at boeing and make sure the union concetrate,s on LANGUAGE WRITTEN IN THE CONTRACT. if the LANGUAGE isn,t their then the same oh __ will keep going on.
Posted by: Anonymous Location: Kansas on Aug 18, 2008 at 07:54 AM
Jeff Hart was my friend,he liked everyone and everyone liked him. This strike needs to end before we lose any more people.
Posted by: union worker Location: ict on Aug 18, 2008 at 07:16 AM
with hbc out on strike and boeing's contract vote looming.....i bet rooney and his crew are sweating it out.. yes..4 4 4 was more across the board than the last 2 contracts....some of the union leaders were wanting pie in the sky figures and i still dont understand how the 10 dollar a month increase in the ins..was gonna take 111 percent of our raises...anyway you look at it...10 bucks is 10 bucks....i guess the I A M uses the M C I math...lol
Posted by: time to work Location: inside looking out on Aug 18, 2008 at 05:44 AM
I hope all the people with the picket signs are ready to go to work when this is all over. There finding out on the inside how much work was really done in a 40 hr work week. You want the great pay and benefits and your going to have to earn it. That means really working maybe 30-35 hours a week instead 22 and goofing off the rest of the time. You have opened the eyes of management on the inside.
Posted by: Mark Bush on Aug 17, 2008 at 11:54 PM
I just started a couple of months ago and can't believe you turned down the contract. What was I thinking about leaving my old job and coming here??? I should have stayed, at least I would still be brining home $$$ every week. At my old place, I never got a raise or anything and I come out here and eveybody strikes. You should be thankful for what you were offered!!!
Posted by: Grandpa's Wife Location: Wichita on Aug 17, 2008 at 09:07 PM
Anonymous: I would still prefer to have a percent of Shuster' Christmas bonus. The 105K Rooney makes in comparision wouldn't even buy that nice pie that HBC's wife likes! ONE MORE DAY!!
Posted by: This is ironic on Aug 17, 2008 at 09:06 PM
You know Bob Wood -- the IAM spokesman who has missed no opportunity to complain about how terrible the 4% raise proposed by HBC is? According to the information made public by the IAM, his last raise was 3.5%! I guess the IAM has a different standard in mind when it's figuring its own raises. Communications Rep Machinists 2006 Salary Breakdown $ 18,297 Administrative (20%) $ 0 Contributions (0%) $ 9,149 General Overhead (10%) $ 9,149 Political (10%) $ 54,892 Representational (60%) $ 91,486 Total Earnings Historical Salary Information Year Salary % Raise Title 2006 $ 91,486 3.5% Communications Rep 2005 $ 88,392 — Communications Rep Source: Department of Labor, Office of Labor Management Standards LM filings
Posted by: Anonymous Location: wichita on Aug 17, 2008 at 07:01 PM
Grandma, FYI, my husband works at HBC and I know from first hand experience that they cut corners even with a full crew. He has had to call he FAA at least twice in the last two years for them cutting corners just to get the planes out on time. One such time (and he was smart and noted everything even the specific plane). They were in a rush to get planes out and they cut corners on the lightning panels. He went to his boss who said just to get it done don't worry about it and guess what? That exact plane came back 9 months later because it was struck by lightning. Now tell me that the engineers are making sure everything is getting done correctly. He made sure that he called the FAA and told them that that was the plane he reported earlier. He has even been reprimanded for refusing to do work that his boss said to do when he AND they knew that was not done to code. At least I know my husband is concerned for the safety of those who buy the plane
Posted by: anonymous on Aug 17, 2008 at 06:27 PM
Grandma...just so you know...the union didn't start the rumor about Dan. That was already spread in flight and plant 4 the Friday before we even voted to strike.
Posted by: reality check Location: wichita on Aug 17, 2008 at 05:27 PM
To Caring Salaried. You must be looking through big smokescreen. Most of the people that do engineering wouldn't know what to do with the wiring harnesses, etc. if they didn't ASK the people on the floor that REALLY know what is going on. There are countless SALARIED workers that we all just can't figure WHAT they do?!?! Lots of walking up and down the aisles oblivious of the DRESS CODE. There are WORTHLESS folks on both sides of the fence. But you just sound STUPID.
Posted by: Gene Location: Janesville, WI on Aug 17, 2008 at 04:38 PM
Hang in there Union brothers!! reading the comments, i can see that the "scabs" don't have one tenth the character that you union brothers have. Only thinking of themselves & let the world be damned! Keep integrity alive! Solidarity!
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 17, 2008 at 03:18 PM
Yep. Seems like the company website has lots of facts that I have yet to see proved wrong, and the union specializes in rumors and innuendo. I suppose you recognized Goldman Sachs (which is a company -- not a person) by the big name tag that said "Hello, I'm Goldman Sachs."
Posted by: Anonymous on Aug 17, 2008 at 03:11 PM
Grandpa's Wife, it's too bad Rooney won't share any of his 105K with anyone. He's still pulling a check while his union brothers and sisters are going on $150 a week. Nice.
Posted by: Oldphart on Aug 17, 2008 at 01:20 PM
Grandma: If you would read carefully, you would see that I said nothing about what you insinuate. I am sorry if you were misled, but comprehension is required to understand what I said. More important would have been to have had the experience I spoke of. If you worked on the floor you would know better. As far as the rumors are concerned, that is what they are. This world is filled with spitefull people that love nothing better than to start them, knowing full well that what they are spreading is false hope. A hope that ethics and moral values will return in the workplace at HBC. If you want your version of what is happening, I would suggest you stick to reading the HBC company web page. The truth is spoken elsewhere.
Posted by: union worker Location: ict on Aug 17, 2008 at 12:01 PM
i heard the Easter Bunny is in town too...and he is having dinner with goldman sachs...lol are you joking...goldman sachs is an investment firm...what they do is buy companies and sell them...jus like the could all tel and then turned around and sold them to verizon.. i so wish i had some ocen front property in andover i could sell some of my union bros and sisters...damn ...i would be so freaking rich!!
Posted by: anonymous Location: plant 4 on Aug 17, 2008 at 10:14 AM
Boy did I ever want a chance to talk to George when he came in and promised change! So tired of the Manager over the Premier line with his unethical values, lies and forcing us to work in unsafe conditions and refusing to allow us to speak to him. Saying, "that's what my team leads are for"...then the team leads say, "we can't talk to him, he won't listen." He has made the premier line the worst place to work. If they'd listen to us employees that line would run so much smoother and we could even have a 3 day move! CAN YOU HEAR US NOW???
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 17, 2008 at 09:21 AM
Oldphart -- I've checked the FAA's website, looking for that news bulletin about HBC lines being shut down. Oddly enough, I'm not finding any such report. Surely the IAM members wouldn't be just making stuff up . . . like negotiations restarting last week, like Dan D. being terminated, etc. etc. Why don't you all provide some corroboration for your stories?
Posted by: grandpa's wife Location: wichita on Aug 17, 2008 at 07:58 AM
If management is doing the strikers jobs and not theirs, yet things are "doing just great inside" doesn't that confirm that management is not necessary or at least top-heavy? If managment is not needed, then HBC can throw their salaries into the pot for the new contract. For those HBC workers who have an unusual situation such as "Sick Wife" and can't do without insurance, you have to do what you have to do. I will keep you in our prayers and I hope you get well soon. Too bad Schuster won't share with you some of his Christmas bonus to help out with your medical expenses.
Posted by: Oldphart on Aug 17, 2008 at 12:37 AM
Grandma: In a normal manufacturing environment, you would be correct. However, this no longer applies to HBC. You have people applying sealer that have never been certified, you have people working as electricians that have no solder certification, and the list goes on. Because the company resists spending money to fix errors on the drawings, they are NOT in compliance. One who worked the shop floor at HBC would know these things. The engineers working the hourly positions have no choice but to follow instructions. That does not mean they have the needed skill sets to perform most of the jobs in manufacturing. With the company's contract offer, what we see is more of the same...instead of taking corrective action to fix those simple things that caused such resentment within the workforce, the SLT has chosen to pretend the problems never existed. It is so sad that so many good people going in to work have to keep their eyes low when they know they are not taking the high road.
Posted by: Union strong Location: Wichita on Aug 17, 2008 at 12:00 AM
Just heard that Goldman-Sachs is in town. Wonder if they are PROUD of the way that HBC is being ran right NOW!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: Striker Location: Rose Hill on Aug 16, 2008 at 09:37 PM
Salaried employees sweeping floors,pulling tape and cleaning doesn't sound like a big threat to our jobs.
Posted by: !!! Location: ict on Aug 16, 2008 at 09:27 PM
reason for 4:30 is some people do go in at 5 and if you go ahead and pull your 4 hours then, then you will be there for the people that come in at 7 and or 8.
Posted by: Ken Location: plt 4 on Aug 16, 2008 at 09:01 PM
To those that can't afford the cobra just save your receits and after the strike is over all of us will have our insurance backdated to the day of the strike and the bills will be paid. that is something that is in all the contracts after a strike is over. Just check with anyone who has ever been in a strike before. Go to your doctor,pay your copay and after the doctor will get his money.
Posted by: union worker Location: ict on Aug 16, 2008 at 08:46 PM
i wonder...if we are suppose to show the hbc management that we are strong...i wonder why the rally is on monday at 4.30..when they dont come to work til 7 or 8 am...hmmmm..i never heard of a rally where it is scheduled at a time when anyone in their right mind is in bed ..lol one day longer..i guess???
Posted by: union worker Location: ict on Aug 16, 2008 at 06:26 PM
this jus came in....the company and the union have a agreed on a new contract ...the comapany threw in a sweet lil bonus..... and rooney and the boys took it... hbc is gonna give the employees coupons for a free scoop of ice cream every month for a year.... that sounds funny but somehting like that will happen ....the strike checks start being written next week!!
Posted by: Grandma on Aug 16, 2008 at 04:38 PM
Aw, come on. Everyone knows that the FAA relies on engineers to ensure compliance with manufacturing standards. And guess who is on the job -- ENGINEERS!
Posted by: A sick wife on Aug 16, 2008 at 04:21 PM
It is not fair to trash those who have to cross the lines. What if they do not have a choice. There are many out there who need health insurance and can not just pray that something happens soon. We new there was a chance that this could happen what we did not know was that my health was going to take a turn for the worse. Now I have a long list of medications and three different doctors taking care of me. While my husband wants to stand strong with his fellow works and what he believes in we do not have the money to pay cobra health insurance. So what do you do? Somebody is going to be mad. He goes to work he gets called a scab he stays walkes lines no health insurance. I am sorry $150 a week won't cover that. People need to do what people do and let stand strong without bashing them becasue they have no clue what is going on in there life. We need to be fighting the company not eachother. It is the company we are mad at not the people who are trying to do what is right by them.
Posted by: Not buying it. Location: ICT on Aug 16, 2008 at 03:47 PM
Really,Good Catch FAA? Is this like the Union passed the rumor around about the HR guy being fired? No one believes the BS anymore.
Posted by: Striking wife on Aug 16, 2008 at 03:22 PM
Just an FYI...if you need any meds filled during the strike, check out Walmart. I went to have mine filled today at Dillons and it saved me $23.00 by switching to Walmart. And right now, $23.00 is $23.00. It's worth it to penny pinch to support my husbands strike! Heck, now that I know this, I may just stay at Walmart even when we get all our benefits back.
Posted by: 88 Location: Salina on Aug 16, 2008 at 02:36 PM
Hey union strikers, you've been sayin' "one more day" for 2 weeks now. In 2 weeks are you going to be sayin' "one more month"?
Posted by: Good catch FAA on Aug 16, 2008 at 02:17 PM
Anyone hear the 4000 line was shut down by the FAA cuz HBC has NOBODY qualified to work on it. Hang in there strikers! Oh yeah, and what about the J-Pats line? It's shut down also...for the same reason. And they say you boys don't have skills!
Posted by: Union proud on Aug 16, 2008 at 02:03 PM
I hope you salaried people like working on the floor because you're going to be there awhile. Who's doing your office jobs while your on the floor. Oh, I forgot, you usually just sit in a cube and surf the net. Don't let George catch ya. A caring hourly.
Posted by: union worker Location: ict on Aug 16, 2008 at 01:51 PM
what the union didnt tell you this time like they told us 4 years ago when the company came up with the attendence policy that if you missed a day ..it counted as 2 infractions was this...they fail to tell you that the compnay can set their own attnedence policy and their own work schedules and according to the labor board the union cant do a thing about it.. the union cant do it all.... how many times have you been on a certain shift and have been told to report to another shift the next week?? and could you or the union do anything about it?? and i dont see or hear that hbc is begging or even contacting the union about presenting a new contract ..if they are the union is keeping us in the dark.. so dont be so sure that we aint all expendible... and like i stated earlier...if i hear no word at all by sept 5th...i will cross.. i will not lose everything i have worked for jus to stoke the union leaderships ego .so they can say what they have done for us..when i havent seen it!
Posted by: Grandpa's Wife Location: Wichita on Aug 16, 2008 at 01:13 PM
To Caring Salaried: Time will tell. Thanks for caring.
Posted by: Grandpa's wife Location: Wichita on Aug 16, 2008 at 01:11 PM
to workers wife-I'm glad you can eat pie now. Wait til your hubby gets fired while he is working with no contract. When my hubby goes back with a contract he was man enough to fight for, you can come to my house and I will give you a slice bought with our new contract money. In the meantime, rest assured, we are still eating because we saved, I work and our union brothers and sisters will stand together and help each other. You all have a right to free speech, but don't berate those who are standing up for themselves. That is the American way. If you don't want to strike, don't, but don't whine about your working conditions when you don't fight for better ones. Remember, when the unions stand up to companies, then all American workers win. Badmouthing no matter what side you're on is a waste of time. If the strikers upset you, don't drive by, turn the channel and don't go to this site. If you have something postive to say, say it loud!! ONE MORE DAY!!
Posted by: union striker Location: 819 on Aug 16, 2008 at 01:07 PM
where's week 2 update on the HBC web site ?they can't copy and paste week 1 can they !!!!!!
Posted by: HBC wife Location: Sedgwick County on Aug 16, 2008 at 12:03 PM
Hands across HBC, be there!!!
Posted by: To_union worker Location: Wichita on Aug 16, 2008 at 10:46 AM
What exactly did you like about the contract? Other than the 4% raises? .. I thought everything else sucked.
Posted by: phooey Location: wichita on Aug 16, 2008 at 10:44 AM
"This not a good long term plan but we are still making more than we are spending, a lot more. We miss you all. Please read the contract." Well of course this isn't a long term plan! They put aside for this all along so they can use the money normally spent on wages, to make things look pretty around the square mile. What are they going to do when they realize that nothing is rolling off the line come the end of the quarter? Hey, your hangar doors look fresh and painted, and you knight rider'd up the office equipment.. what about your customers?? I've had it. I'm going to Cessna. It's been a fun 10 years.. well, not really.
Posted by: HBC Wife Location: Salin on Aug 16, 2008 at 10:41 AM
Mmm pie sounds good. Thank goodness I can afford it.
Posted by: No_YouranIdiot Location: Wichita on Aug 16, 2008 at 10:28 AM
Cliff or any of us union members aren't here to earn awards for spelling (Heck, I know a lot of managers at work who can't spell their way out of a wind tunnel), just as long as you get the general idea, okay? Anyways, seems like you know a lot about the hard knock life with your colorful description. I take it you've been there once before? That said, take your desk imprinted fat belly out of here and keep your lunk-headed stereotypes to yourself.
Posted by: Oldphart on Aug 16, 2008 at 09:34 AM
To CaringSalaried: The reason the strike happened....had everything to do with ethics and not money. It had to do with unfair labor prcatices. Having to repeatedly work overtime to catch up or fix up things that should have been addressed by engineering. It had to do with leadership turning their heads the other way when they KNEW team leads created many of the morale problems. And all the shortcuts in processes that caused so much rework, time and time again, yet those in control would do nothing about it. You want to know WHY there was a strike? Ask the people and you will find out why they saw the union as the only avenue for a solution. The company did not care then. Why would they care now? What has changed? The leadership structure at HBC is based on good news only. Any supervisor that brings his boss unfavorable news will not be there long. At Beech, if you made a mistake, you corrected it, taught others, and built a better product. At HBC, the culture hides it.
Posted by: union worker Location: ict on Aug 16, 2008 at 09:08 AM
there is a lack of info..about anything ...but there is not a like of hype..and figures you are exactley right..Steve Rooney wont go without a union pay check and neither will any of his possee and we have yet to see this magical back up contract the union sez that the company always has ready when the first one is rejected and oh btw ..i was of the 11 percent that liked the contract.... union bros and siters..if you learn anything at all from this is..do you own thinking !!!
Posted by: grandma on Aug 16, 2008 at 09:05 AM
Rally planned for Monday morning. Given the union members' tendency to miss Mondays when they are SUPPOSED to be working, maybe they should have scheduled it for Tuesday!
Posted by: Cliffsanidiot Location: In a house on Aug 16, 2008 at 08:27 AM
I'll bet Cliff lives in a trailer, has rent to own furniture, smokes 4 packs of Marboro's a day, has no savings, doesn't own a toothbrush, but still manages to buy $20 worth of "quick picks" and a case of Old Milwaukee per day! You ever notice that the majority of these union members can barely spell?
Posted by: CaringSalaried on Aug 15, 2008 at 11:28 PM
Hey union members, This is from a non union in the company who is little appauled one of yours would go on record and call Dan Dymarkowski a liar. This is unbelievable and unforgiveable. There are really 1000 plus workers on the floor, well over 20% and growing. It has grown every day as we obviously track it every morning. Most team leads and managers on the floor were some of the best mechanics and most technical people we have. That adds another 300 plus skilled workers on the floor. What about all those MEs and QEs. Pretty good hands on folks. Many of you hourlies have benefited from the college education we paid for and you moved on to salary jobs. Guess what, they are on the floor to. Another couple hundred there. You would not believe the productivity of these people just to prove you all wrong. Aircraft are moving and we are celebrating. This not a good long term plan but we are still making more than we are spending, a lot more. We miss you all. Please read the contract.
Posted by: HBC for 17 plus years!!! on Aug 15, 2008 at 11:20 PM
What web site do I use to apply for Cessna, I really want a decent job, tooo!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: BONNIE Location: HUTCHINSON on Aug 15, 2008 at 11:17 PM
HANG IN THERE IAM. YOU ARE STRONG. HOPEFULLY THE COMPANY WILL WAKE UP AND REALIZE WHAT THEY'VE GOT AND SHOW GRATITUDE, RESPECT AND APPRECIATION FOR YOUR MANY YEARS OF DEVOTED SERVICE AND RE-THINK THEIR MIND SET.
Posted by: Flyonthewall Location: wichita on Aug 15, 2008 at 10:59 PM
I have a friend who couldn't help but cross the line. Some information from him: 1. Dan is NOT fired. 2. They are doing major remodeling; that includes repainting the jigs in plant 2 and repainting the delivery bay at flight. 3. Managers working out on the floor are screwing things up.. 4. Contractors working on the king airs have not a clue what they're doing. 5. They are not sweating the strike ONE BIT. If they came back to work anytime soon, they would only get in the way of all the remodeling they're doing. 6. There are barbecues and all you can drink pepsi every day! 7. Pilots are taking days off left and right because they fear for their life. 8. they plan on offering THE SAME contract in about two weeks after the remodeling is finished. Business as usual you think? Sounds like the guys who ran Joyland into the ground are running HBC now. Now's the perfect time for an FAA audit. They seem to be around all time in the past... WHY NOT NOW??
Posted by: Anonymous on Aug 15, 2008 at 10:56 PM
After years and years of working at Hawker Beechcraft, and giving, and giving to this community, I cant believe the lack of support given to us from the community. People, we are living off the savings we have been putting away 4 years, so maybe you should go to work and stop looking for the handouts we have given you, because right now we are going to take care of ourselves and our children!!!Its about time you do the same!!!
Posted by: Figures Location: ICT on Aug 15, 2008 at 10:28 PM
Lookee-you CAN'T agrue with those numbers! (Even if they are 2005) You KNOW Rooney wouldn't take a pay cut OR go with out while his brothers and sisters get $150?! NO WAY!!
Posted by: leaving HBC on Aug 15, 2008 at 09:08 PM
I've sent my resume to Spirit and Cessna!
Posted by: Lookee Here on Aug 15, 2008 at 07:38 PM
For some reason . . . the IAM hasn't posted salary information after 2005. I doubt that they have taken any pay cut, though.
Posted by: Striker Location: ICT on Aug 15, 2008 at 06:53 PM
OldPhart- Thank you for your words of wisdom...:) Lookee- Nice "2005" facts...
Posted by: HBC STRIKER Location: Wichita on Aug 15, 2008 at 06:49 PM
I have heard from friends working inside that HBC has fired two people who would not work OUT OF THEIR JOB CODE... You have to do WHATEVER they tell you to. Managers are building creform parts fixtures and jpats employees are cleaning in plant 4. There is NO CONTRACT.. If you cross and they FIRE you I am sorry to say you deserve it. I would not work at HBC under NO CONTRACT. I bet those people who got fired are trying to join the union now... I hope the people from ONEX tell Schuster to get this over with.. It is really not that hard. MONDAY AT 4:30AM SEE ALL HBC STRIKERS!!!! WE ARE STANDING STRONG AND IT WILL BE BETTER!!!!!
Posted by: union worker Location: ict on Aug 15, 2008 at 06:24 PM
there had better be more money than that ..but if that is true..it all is bcoming more and more clearer
Posted by: Lookee Here on Aug 15, 2008 at 06:11 PM
Some members of the IAM won't be needing that $150 per week. Check this out http://www.unionfacts.com/unions/unionOfficers.cfm?id=37332&year=2005
Posted by: FINALLY Location: ICT on Aug 15, 2008 at 06:02 PM
Union Worker-THANK YOU FOR YOUR INTELLIGENT WORDS. You TRULY have a backbone.
Posted by: yikess on Aug 15, 2008 at 05:58 PM
I heard that there is only enough money in the strike fund with the union to last 2 weeks. Is that true???
Posted by: Oldphart on Aug 15, 2008 at 04:50 PM
To Wondering: Please read again. You take only what you want from the text and suggest an alternative meaning. You can spin all you want, however, if you read my comments with more care than you must have read the contract proposal, you would have come to a more logical conclusion. Your post shows otherwise. However you present your case, both the company and the union are losing. There are no winners. And if you think different, then you are probably part of the problem that started this mess to begin with. I pray you come to your senses soon.
Posted by: union worker Location: ict on Aug 15, 2008 at 04:31 PM
in all honesty..that was the best comtract offer in the 9 years i have been with the company...as i sit and listen to my union bros and sisters...i wonder if the union told you to jump off a building i think most of you all would... also...if the company is hurting so bad ..dont ya think they would have offered another contract or at least talked to the union by now??? as for firing dan d...why would they ?? he did what the company told him to offer..he doesnt own the company ..he isn the ceo.... please union brothers and sister take off your blinders....we will go back with a lesser contract than before and...you all complained about all the over time....well you will have to work all kinds now jus to try to keep what you have..a union sister last night told me she had to have a yard sale jus to scrap up enough money to drive to the picket line...i will stay out til labor day and if there hasnt been any talks..i will walk...and resign from the union
Posted by: Wondering on Aug 15, 2008 at 02:40 PM
To Oldphart: You keep saying that Dan Dymarkowski has been fired, and now you've broadened that to include the entire negotiation team. I'm wondering how you would possibly know any employee's status, since Human Resources doesn't have any bargaining unit positions. Better stick to the facts. Or at least rumors that you might possibly know something about.
Posted by: DecrypteR on Aug 15, 2008 at 02:00 PM
James E Schuster. Age 53. Total Annual Compensation 538,910. Total stock options 275,573. Total market value $2,035,225. Eveybody knows what the aircraft workers make. Here is what the ceo makes.. (><)
Posted by: unionproud Location: wichita on Aug 15, 2008 at 01:57 PM
HBC wife you are pretty big sitting there typing things about people on strike, and your husband is pretty big riding my coat tail.....I guess you support our jobs going to Mexico, then what will your husband do???I guess you and your husband support higher insurance and a 4% raise that will not even cover the cost in insurance. You and your husband need to read over the contract and have someone translate it for you so you can understand all the take aways that are in it...I hope your husband is ready for the real workers to come back, he won't even be able to look us in the eye..UNION ALL THE WAY.......
Posted by: unionproud Location: wichita on Aug 15, 2008 at 01:41 PM
I can't believe people post and say the union is bs...I guess that means they support our jobs going to Mexico,and they support a company who lies and hides things.The company relies on us to make aircraft,which brings the company billions of dollars..And then they try to get us to accept a contract that they claim is the best contract in twenty years.I am sorry but that is a slap in our face, by the very company that we help by working every day......We deserve a fair contract,and the one the company wanted us to accept was not FAIR...HBC has thousands of employees and yet we pay a lot in insurance that does not sit well with a lot of people.When I worked for a small company my insurance was outrageous and I could understand that, but not when there are thousands of employees....All the company does is look out for themselves when it is us the workers that are bringing in the money that the company gets....People keep posting your company support it only makes the union stronger.......
Posted by: cessna here i come Location: 819 no longer on Aug 15, 2008 at 12:54 PM
i start monday at cessna to bad hawkerbeechcraft you just lost and the way it's looking ,still losing
Posted by: Union Steward Location: Wichita on Aug 15, 2008 at 12:05 PM
I wish that everyone would quit referring to Schuster and his team of misfits as leaders!!!! They are not!!! Webster defines leadership.....leadership Main Entry: lead·er·ship Pronunciation: \ˈlē-dər-ˌship\ Function: noun Date: 1821 1 : the office or position of a leader 2 : capacity to lead 3 : the act or an instance of leading 4 : leaders They need to attend a good leadership school like our union provides then maybe moral would not be so low!!! Maybe SLT should stand for Same Losing Team!! There is no "capacity to lead" at HBC all the way down to the "teamleaders". Stay strong union brothers and sisters, one day longer!!!!
Posted by: Anonymous Location: Kansas on Aug 15, 2008 at 11:58 AM
HBC-STRIKE Day 10 I'm sure we have planes to build but I'm not sure we will have people to build them. I have several friends that have gotten work elsewhere and are encouraging me to apply. I have to much time with this company and my roots are in Wichita. I don't think of the high cost of selling their houses and the cost of relocating is worth leaving. They are looking at it as an adventure. I wisk them luck. We need to get back to work before there are too many holes left by productive employees leaving. The economy is down for most around the country but not for experienced aircraft workers. I would like to know of others who have friends leaving for Colorado, Georgia, Texas or just over to Cessna. I haven't heard of anyone going to Spirit. They don't want to deal with that strike in 2010.
Posted by: Oldphart on Aug 15, 2008 at 10:26 AM
Rumors have been floating that Dan D. had been fired. That is a rumor and has yet to be substantiated either way. Another similar rumor is that the entire staff that was on the bargaining table was removed. That is in the same category as the first...wishful thinking. All we know for sure is that ONEX was in town for a board meeting with the HBC. It would be nice to be a fly on the wall, however, I think it is best the company work this strike issue out themselves. They ensured the members would turn down the contract offer. The company will signal when they want to end it. They have been silent so far. Those that crossed the picket line have given the company their approval of not only the contract, but also whatever terms, conditions, and rules that were part of the last contract. That makes it that much harder to communicate to the company how badly morale was affected during the last contract.
Posted by: cliff Location: wichita on Aug 15, 2008 at 10:06 AM
I dont ownder why the jobs have been going overseas, the us govt subsidises it. Pacific rim initiative and such. tax breaks and free money for companies to move.
Posted by: Proud Location: ICT on Aug 15, 2008 at 10:02 AM
I have faith the Company will come to their senses. We have to give them time for their larger than average egos to deflate awhile. I know they can't produce a chart or graph that explains how this is benefiting themselves as a world leader in general aviation. They still have that record backlog of 7.4 billion dollars that has not and will not decrease at the pace they are holding onto. All of you who are standing for what they believe in are doing a fantastic job!
Posted by: Just The Truth Location: Wichita on Aug 15, 2008 at 10:00 AM
I really think that HBC will not last long if this is the way they run a business, This is craze specially if you have a back log!! This should be resolved ASAP!! I think the city of Wichita should have something to say about all of this. HBC knew this was a union company when they bought it I say if you want more planes to be ordered you best get this resolved or Cessna is going to get all of the orders good for them go Cessna.
Posted by: Disgruntled on Aug 15, 2008 at 08:04 AM
HBC would rather pay $250,000 for security, pay for gates and cameras, buy scab lunches everyday, lose profits on planes, etc.etc.etc. than give us a d**n raise. I don't even want to go back to the stupid place.
Posted by: Anonymous on Aug 15, 2008 at 06:57 AM
Just think, you non-union people and those who can't get a job in aircraft for whatever reason you say, what do you think it is gonna do to the Wichita economy next month when HBC is still on strike and then Boeing goes on strikle? Oh yeah, and don't forget Spirit, they plan to go to a 24 hour work week if this happens. Wichita will be in a world of hurt. Aircraft IS the back bone of Wichita....whether you people want to believe it or not. So HBC needs to suck it up and get their workers back working! They need to stop being greedy and start thinking of the economy.
Posted by: Me Location: wichita on Aug 15, 2008 at 06:53 AM
And the unions wonder why jobs keeping going overseas.
Posted by: Wife of Cessna worker on Aug 15, 2008 at 06:43 AM
My husband works in production at Cessna. He told me that at least a dozen workers from Beech have started at Cessna in his plant. He's glad to see experienced workers come in and take some of the load off of him. He's been working overtime all year.
Posted by: Steve Location: Salina on Aug 15, 2008 at 06:16 AM
I am still having a hard time with, why didn't the boeing strikers a few years ago get talked about as bad as us HBC strikers. We are trying to better ourselves and you ppl that aren't bright enough to be able to get a good job then I am sorry for you and your family. We are skilled workers and need to be treated as such. I love my job at HBC and I am ready to go back but without a contract you can't trust our bosses. If you ppl think that we are being greedy we are not. I personally don't care about all you crybabies that think that we shouldn't be standing up for what we believe in. HBC employees need to continue fight for what we believe in.......... We will win this battle, with or without the support of the community.... ONE DAY LONGER!!!
Posted by: Toddhasbeenspotted Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:36 PM
I see the comment about Todd Westerfield has been deleted. I guess he wrote and told Kake that he didn't want anyone to know that he was indeed mowing the lawn down in Salina plant for 100k a year! HAHAHA Business as usual!!
Posted by: flightmechanic Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:26 PM
I have been gainfully employed since the age of 16 and only held 3 jobs my whole life - retail, The USAF, and now Beech. I am a hard worker and also pro-union. My reliability record speaks for itself. This is the first time that I've walked out on the job, however, it's for a good cause. I believe we can get a better contract - not this 'add here but take away there' nonsense. So to all putting forth a lot of negativity, think before you call us lazy and good for nothing. It is very unwarranted and baseless.
Posted by: Sweat and Blood Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:15 PM
First of all , someone hits you ,you hit back. We are being pushed around at HBC. I have a family and I like time to spend with them.HBC would rather see me at work 7 days a week 52 weeks of the year. And for all of you who say " I would like to have a job at that pay. " Why have you not applied. Oh by the way the courts have told the union how many can walk the line. Its 4 only. We have rules we have to go by and so far we have followed them. No damage to anybody stuff has happened. get your facts straight. Its not about the pay . Its about respect. Dont take away from me when your getting more JIM .
Posted by: Little but loud Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 10:30 PM
I have an idea, how about everyone shut up!!!!! If you don't work aircraft and want to voice your opinion go apply! If not like I said earlier SHUT YOUR PIE HOLE!!!
Posted by: bettereducatedworker Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 09:26 PM
"I have just come to the conclusion that you have not been a manager yourself and have never worked as a professional in an office setting..so you wouldn't know what a company's bottom line looks like or is truly comprised of." I do know that a manager becomes someone's whipping boy on a daily basis. They look at the numbers and wonder why it's not getting from A to B and then put the pressure on the workers or else their boss will start clearing their belt loops! but they don't take into consideration factors that might effect from A to B - lack of parts, unforeseen technical problems or bad management decisions. I worked on second shift for a whole year with no management and realized things ran more smooth and efficient as ever. We knew what was going on in that shop floor because we weren't in the office a/c staring at a bunch of stupid graphs. All that is really needed is a crew chief to handle the pass-down and that's it. Managers are nothing but glorified baby-sitters.
Posted by: Hey_HBCwife on Aug 14, 2008 at 09:12 PM
"..But get off the backs of your co-workers who are smart enough to keep their financial security and health care for their families. They did not cause this problem nor do they have the power to solve your ridiculous dispute with management" B.S. They do have the power to solve this 'ridiculous' dispute - by staying united. But obviously a lot of people haven't a clue what that means. Don't you think it would have been easier to just simply show up for work and just go about our business?? We chose the harder path - that is to make a stand. I'm so sick of people applauding the weak and defaming the brave. It makes Wichita look like a state of spineless idiots. I hope the lot of you enjoy those tasty barbecues in there while we fight for what's right from the outside. They're just fattening you up for the kill.
Posted by: Still Standing Proud Location: The Air Capital! on Aug 14, 2008 at 08:59 PM
Why is so hard for people to understand you have to stand for something you truly believe in? Maybe because you are not one of the dedicated employees that take pride in themselves for the accomplishments they have put forth, and got to actually vote on this contract.I am from the old school 8 hours work for 8 hours pay. The company and myself have both benefited from my work ethic. Emotions,tempers and ego's are flaring on both sides of the issue, it's not all one sided. We are in this for future generations to come.I'm not sure any of you would have voted to accept a contract that gave the company the ability to layoff 25% of any department every six months. Thats 2 years and your departments gone.I know I could not vote for that, and anyone that did probably is having a hard time standing without that backbone. I am willing to take a stand on that issue alone. I call that JOB SECURITY! Stand Proud!
Posted by: worker Location: Salina on Aug 14, 2008 at 08:53 PM
HBC wife, shut your mouth. Most of the ones that have crossed are the ones that we have had to listen to for the last three years complain that we should have striked. This is not a ridiculous dispute, this is a group of highly skilled workers who are tired of being beaten down and have the courage to fight for what they believe in. Most of us that work there have families that we enjoy being with. With the work schedule changing every 90 days it would cause strain on the family. When you go to work in the aviation field you know that there are going to be layoffs and maybe a strike. You can save money each week. $5-$10 a week for three years you do the math. If you can't, then you don't know how to manage your money. For the rest of you haters, if the company is so great go out and apply. If not, don't make comments about conditions you have no idea of.
Posted by: Shaddap Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 08:49 PM
"Boy oh boy PAMPERS would make a killing here in Wichita. With all the cry babies going at it....." Yep, that's true. And that would make you guys our baby wipes.
Posted by: !!! Location: ict on Aug 14, 2008 at 08:48 PM
I admit I have personally called one person a scab, he's not worth calling that much. he's worthless anyways. But me calling him that was even AFTER I was almost run over, because someone wasn't following COMPANY RULES and only doing 3 MPH while pulling in. I'm not one to berate most people. I personally know alot of people that are in there everyday now. Salary workers, and some contractors. I know they have to be in there or they lose their job. There are some of those people that I know would be out there with us if they could, and they also know the better we get the better they get.
Posted by: Shaddap Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 08:44 PM
Teri, if you're so much more intelligent than us apes, why aren't YOU making more money?
Posted by: Thank you Location: plant 4 on Aug 14, 2008 at 08:21 PM
I just wanted to thank all of the local businesses showing their support for the strike. We are truly greatful! We will return the favor when we receive a fair contract. Thank you so much. ONE DAY LONGER!!
Posted by: Aynonmous Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 07:54 PM
Boy oh boy PAMPERS would make a killing here in Wichita. With all the cry babies going at it.....
Posted by: Teri Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 07:48 PM
For those of you that have said that we should go and apply and we haven't seen the contract, well... many have applied but the only thing keeping them from getting on at HBC is lack of experience, they would show up every day and be ever so grateful for the pay and benefits, I have family that works out at HBC, and they thought the contract was pretty good. They are GRATEFUL for that pay and benefits considering how the economy is now a days. I make just above minimum wage, and I do okay, I don't live above my means. Whats made it bad for those of you who may have a legitmate complaint are the ones who behave like they have the intelligence of an ape. Maybe if some of you would behave like mature adults, your cause would hold more clout.
Posted by: Auntir Em Location: Ict on Aug 14, 2008 at 06:31 PM
Cliff, you truly are a sad, sad little boy.
Posted by: Kansas on Aug 14, 2008 at 05:17 PM
Think of all the non productive labor working our jobs. When we go back to work we will have alot of rework to do. With out the work of the hourly workers there would be no product and there would be no pay for the non hourly employees or non productive labor. Many of us strikers have close friends working on the inside and comparing stories we have a really good idea on how much is getting done. I don't know why so many un truths are being spread and for whose benifit, most of what is wrong with HBC is the lies and secrets that are being kept there is always an uneasiness at work and a distrust of everything that is being communicated. Whether there are false statements or hidden agendas in the contract or not we have been lied to so many times in recent times that we believe they are there. I miss being at work and will be glad to get back to fixing the planes but I hope we learn how to communicate and be truthful and honest with each other.
Posted by: going to Cessna on Aug 14, 2008 at 04:39 PM
Word is Cessna is hiring. They have a large backlog and lots of planes to build. Besides, they pay better and have better benefits. I know because HBC CEO's told us so.
Posted by: HBC Wife Location: Salina on Aug 14, 2008 at 04:36 PM
WTH is wrong with you picketers? Are you mentally ill or just learning disabled? If you are stupid enough to gamble losing your jobs,pay, and benefits, fine that is your choice. But get off the backs of your co-workers who are smart enough to keep their financial security and health care for their families. They did not cause this problem nor do they have the power to solve your ridiculous dispute with management. You strikers should be ashamed of yourselves, cussing at,condemning, and damaging property of people with enough character to go to work everyday and earn their paycheck so they can support themselves. If you are lucky enough to have a job to go back to in a few months you should apologize to all the innocent bystanders you berated. What makes you think you will be able to keep your job after this strike is over anyway? Why would any company want to keep troublemakers like you all around? Think about that before you pick up another picket sign!
Posted by: Rally Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 01:26 PM
I happen to like Beanie Weenies, and I'm not on strike, and I do have access to some of the best beef evah!
Posted by: sheesh Location: boredville on Aug 14, 2008 at 12:42 PM
Man, all you people need to get over yourself a bit. Cliff, get a new rap. You make the same type comments, not matter what the story is, and you comment on about all the stories. You seem pretty intelligent, but get over yourself a little bit.
Posted by: Union Steward Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 12:33 PM
Cliff, Amen brother, we will stay strong and win not only the battle but the war!!! God bless all the American fighting men and women, for without them, past and present, Educated Worker and all the other negetive minds out there would not have the right to free speech!!!! Sometimes we have to fight for what's right and now is the time. Stay strong brothers and sisters, keep your eye on the prize!!!!
Posted by: !!! Location: ict on Aug 14, 2008 at 12:20 PM
to educated worker ... where are the laws that say they can't make you work everyday of the month. i talked to a lawyer about that a few years ago and there is no such law. they might have to pay you a little more but they can make you work if you are in a non union shop.
Posted by: cliff Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 12:12 PM
Educated Worker, check out history of Huffy bicycles, they outsourced to china and got rid of all their employees, their bikes are still the same price as before. now they want the govt to step in and take over the retirement pay for their retirees because they are making so little money. right, cost of bike 5.00 price of bike 100.00, bottom line no profit, no lazy american union workers, just creative bookeeping. thats a simple verifiable fact. also, the hgher management saleries and bonus's these days make the wages paid to "lazy union workers" insignificant.
Posted by: Willy Location: Chicago on Aug 14, 2008 at 12:06 PM
The worker suffers eating bennie weenie while the Union Fat cats eat steak and cash in off the backs of their mules.
Posted by: Educated Worker Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:58 AM
Yes, Cliff, I know the effects of outsourcing. I have already lost one job in my career because of it. I have just come to the conclusion that you have not been a manager yourself and have never worked as a professional in an office setting..so you wouldn't know what a company's bottom line looks like or is truly comprised of. Companies have to work to keep their profits at a point that they can pay workers like you what a union demands and still make a profit. It is the union and inefficient workers demanding more pay and benefits that drive up the cost of production and force companies to outsource so they can still make a profit. No, that is not "management speak." Those are the simple facts.
Posted by: cliff Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:49 AM
Auntie Em, no, no pressure at all. especially from anti union managers like you.
Posted by: Auntie Em Location: ICT on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:38 AM
Feeling pressure from the Repo man, Cliff? Go to your corner, little man!
Posted by: KAY Location: ANDOER on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:35 AM
STOP IT!!!!!!IF YOU DO NOT WORK AT HB THEN YOU DO NOT KNOW WHAT THE CONTRACT SAID. THE "FREE FOOD" IS NOT FREE.IT IS PAID WITH UNION DUES THAT THE EMPLOYEES GIVE TO THE UNION EVERY WK.I HAVE BEEN LAID OFF TWICE WITH BOEING AND BEEN ON STRIKE ALSO. MY JOB WAS GIVEN TO MEXICO AND I DID NOT HEAR ONE FRIEND SAY "I AM SORRY" AMERICANS ARE LAZY ,STAND UP KEEP OUR JOBS HERE.AGAIN PEOPLE DO NOT KNOW THE FACTS AND I SAY TO ALL THE TEACHERS, FAST FOOD WORKERS, RETAIL WORKERS FILL OUT A JOB APPLICATION AT HB, BOEING,ANY AIRCRAFT JOB.STOP COMPLAINING!!!!!!!!!AND YES I WORK AT A OFFICE AND I AM THANKFUL THAT I GET TO GO TO WORK NOT HAVE TO GO TO WORK.I WONDER HOW MANY OF YOU ACTUALLY WENT OUT TO VOTE LAST TUESDAY.TO THE PERSON WHO COMMENTED ON HER HUSBAND IN THE ARMY-GET OVER IT . HE KNEW WHAT HE SIGNED UP FOR. MY FATHER SERVED THE AIR FORCE FOR 30 YRS.HE ALSO WENT TO WAR AND NEVER ONCE COMPLAINED.SO STOP!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: cliff Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:31 AM
educated worker, "paying lazy workers" "paying for performance" " getting paid just because you show up" stock remarks for management. I have seen what the government has done to labor laws, and its mostly weaken them. I have also heard the stock remark about outsourcing, "do you want to pay higher prices?" when a company outsources for lower costs, they dont pass savings on to consumers, prices usually stay the same, while the chinese imports they sell made by people making less per day or week than american workers improve "bottom line" and american workers lose their jobs. I also see the health care costs go up every contract, while the companies part of the costs decreases. the companies could try to get better contracts with the insurance companies, but instead choose to pass the costs on to workers.
Posted by: Educated Worker Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:17 AM
Cliff - there was no "vailed" threat there...just letting you know that your posts make you sound incredibly ignorant. I have been out of college for over ten years and have worked as a manager. I know the value of a good employee...which many HBC workers are proving themselves to not be. Yes, I know what the real world is like. I put myself through college to get where I am and am still paying for it. I believe in being paid for performance and not just being handed a raise just because you show up to work. There are labor laws that prevent sweatshop conditions...maybe you should educate yourself on the original purpose of unions and what the government has done regarding labor laws before you start making comments...and making yourself look even more ignorant.
Posted by: cliff Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:08 AM
and another antiunion psuedointelectual heard from. No thanks I have a job. do you? why do you get on a hbc strike comment board with nothing but a personal attack? too educated" to get a good job? jelous?
Posted by: Singlemom Location: plant 4 on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:05 AM
To the military wife.....thank God for your husband and the sacrafices your family has made for us. I believe your husband and the military would stand behind us because their are many ex-military standing on the picket lines with us. We are fighting for the jobs that your husband my love to have when he gets back. We are AMERICAN and want your family and ours the opportunity for a great job. Thanks so much for serving our county.
Posted by: Cliffhater Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 11:01 AM
Get a job cliff, no one wants to listen to your ignorance.
Posted by: cliff Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 10:57 AM
educated worker, why should I quit posting? what is this vailed threat about "not doing myself any favors"? just a college educated salaried person trying to get hourly people to shut up, because our opinions dont count.
Posted by: cliff Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 10:12 AM
Educated Worker, obvoiusly you arent a hourly employee. six years of college isnt exactly hourly, have you ever worked for a company where you werent a manager? how do you know what the real world is like? the owrld where people like you think that giving yourselvs hundred thousand dollar bonus is acceptable to people working under you who get nothing? if not for unions we would be back to sweatshops, just look at the politically correct treatment of "illeagles", no vacation, under minimum wage and such. all with the knowlege and concent of the government.
Posted by: Educated Worker Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 10:04 AM
Cliff - would you please quit posting on every website that is carrying these stories? You are not doing yourself any favors.
Posted by: obvious on Aug 14, 2008 at 10:02 AM
i guess if you are so worried about cutting cost to support your families during this time of need, the internet, cable, newspaper, and other things need to go. And if you don't feel like doing that, go be lazy and fill out a state form. I'm so excited about more money being taken out of my check so that you can "fight" for your job. Hey I'm a hard worker and a college student, do I get to cry every time my insurance goes up? everytime I go to the store and groceries cost more? no i don't. don't be part of the problem, be part of the solution.
Posted by: Educated Worker Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 09:55 AM
I am so tired of listening to you people say that this strike isn't about the money and then saying that you "want your share." If it isn't about the money then what exactly is it that you want your share of? And btw...there are labor laws that prevent the company from forcing you to work every day of the month. Unions have long outlived their usefulness and are no longer necessary. I have six years of college and work for one of the largest non-aircraft companies in Wichita and you guys still make more money and have better benefits than I do. I know this because I have worked for Raytheon in the past and have a relative that currently works there. I choose to not work in aircraft any more so that I don't have to deal with people like you.
Posted by: cliff Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 09:47 AM
the reason unions exist? how about working conditions, pay and benifits, safety, and the fact that most employers dont really care about their employees only the bottom line. they may say they care, but how ofter do they contract your job or outsource your work without any notice. at least they nolonger hire gangs or armies to kill strikers like they used to.
Posted by: striker's wife Location: plant 4 on Aug 14, 2008 at 09:42 AM
Why aren't they posting my comments?? I have seen much worse on this site!! IT'S NOT ABOUT THE MONEY!! It's about all the take aways and BS this company is trying to feed us. I'm sick and tired of my husband and his fellow union members being called greedy for sticking up for themselves and not laying down like dogs and taking it. You wish you had this job, well guess what FILL OUT AN APPLICATION! The food that is being delivered to us is not a handout by the way, we paid for it with our union dues!! Just because we want something better for our families does not make us greedy! I feel sorry for you people that never fight for what you believe is right. We will get what we are fighting for, while all the scabs who crossed get to suck it up as well. We will stay out one day longer and we will get a better contract. Stay strong union members! ONE DAY LONGER!!
Posted by: Union Member Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 09:08 AM
I happen to know Brad and Lisa C. I called them and they say the comments below were written by a non union member using their names that does not like them. Shame on you non union member. ,
Posted by: dennis Location: augusta on Aug 14, 2008 at 08:40 AM
Dose anyone remember why unions exist historicaly ?
Posted by: Anonymous Location: Wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 08:38 AM
Can I have a handout? I didn't walk off the job like a baby. And to USW member....you say we are idiots and not smart enough, nice grammer. quote"...or they done would have." end quote. Try getting an education and then you wouldn't jump everytime a union fat cat says so
Posted by: Union Made on Aug 14, 2008 at 08:33 AM
George Ngyuen told the scabs, yesterday at lunch, that no negotiations are planned. So, dig in, it may be awhile.
Posted by: cliff Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 07:31 AM
you want to know who these anti union, anti strikers are? just look at their posts, they mention "saleries" that means they are saleried not hourly, management probably. and the rest, who post uneducated remarks without any imagination, probably the contractors hired to make the parking lots look full. the rest are just jelous of the fact that you can do something about your job conditions and benifits, unlike the un unionized sheep they are.
Posted by: Union wife Location: Plant 4 on Aug 14, 2008 at 07:25 AM
How many times do you ignorant people have to be told IT'S NOT ABOUT THE MONEY!! It's about all the take aways and the BS this company is trying to feed us. I'm sick and tired of my husband and his fellow union members being called greedy for sticking up for themselves and not laying down like dogs and taking it. "So many people would love to have your job" you say, well guess what FILL OUT AN APPLICATION! We will stick together, we will stay out one day longer and we will get a better contract. This company has been lying to everyone of us and now the media! They are not getting squat done. It's disgusting. Stay strong union members, we will get what we are fighting for! ONE DAY LONGER!!
Posted by: Stike thier @! on Aug 14, 2008 at 07:07 AM
The few people that have crossed in my department are the lazy, worthless ones that always hold up the line....always. Hbc deserves them.
Posted by: abunch on Aug 14, 2008 at 06:26 AM
It's Thursday...what happened to the union telling everyone that they would be back to the negotiating table by Friday???? That was just the unions hopeful wishing so they wouldn't have to be cutting a whole lot of checks next week! When it comes to them paying out their money their greedy also!!!!
Posted by: Going to Cessna on Aug 14, 2008 at 06:23 AM
I'm a striker and am currently employed at HBC. I work on the Hawker line. I've been there almost 10 years and I know that supervision likes me as a worker. I sent in an updated resume to Cessnajobs.com the week before the strike just in case things got bad. Well, guess what....I GOT THE JOB!!!! I know two other Hawker Beechcrafters who have put in thier resumes to Cessna and one of them has an interview Friday. I've told other strikers on the picket line and they say that they are putting thier resumes in also. It's easy. Me being on strike didn't seem to phase them at all. As far as pay, Cessna starts me out low but when I reach the top of my grade I'll be making $1.27 more per hour than HBC, even after the 4% raise. Better retirement and a 401. Better insurance. They are looking for experienced assemblers, tooling, and painters just to name a few. I will still be walking the picket line to support my fellow employees. I start Cessna a week from Monday. In your face HBC!!!!
Posted by: Anonymous on Aug 14, 2008 at 06:04 AM
Seems like people are upset about the strikers getting food. Guess businesses at least remember who was giving support on charity drives and would go buy from them. The money isn't coming out of the publics pocket so don't worry about it, although you might need something else to complain about in a issue that for most doesn't even affect them. If you are worried about the wages they recieve because you don't get that much or someone with a college degree doesn't get that much then who's fault is that? Is anything stopping you from applying for this noskill job that is so easy? Maybe it is that you don't have the skills that the companies want and that is why they are having a training center? Maybe you don't have the gumption to leave your job and go and insted want to complain about others. Nobody ever said that a degree insured a good paying job. If you are crossing fine, but don't complain about how you are treated when it is over.
Posted by: worker Location: wichita on Aug 14, 2008 at 12:00 AM
I wish I could walk off my job and my fellow coworkers give me food. GO BACK TO WORK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: MilitaryWife Location: KS on Aug 13, 2008 at 11:58 PM
For once, I would like to see someone come to their senses and just stop complaining. My husband is military and works overseas on the flight line where it is easily 130 degrees. Tell me what options they have if the military doesn't want to work? They can't go to the Commander & Chief and say "Sorry my work conditions suck and you don't pay me enough, I'm not coming to work until this gets changed" It just doesn't work like that in the real world. What about teachers, they don't get paid enough, so are they going to tell the taxpayers that they are not going to teach anymore because of the rude/disrepectful kids and lack of pay? I don't think so. Why then is it OK for people who make $18 /hr 40-70 hrs/week with overtime pay to complain about how much they make? The military gets paid salary to be in Iraq for 1 year, no overtime and no options for a "STRIKE". I just want you think about how good you really do have it and take into consideration people who don't have the same luxuries.
Posted by: dwayne Location: wichita on Aug 13, 2008 at 11:38 PM
thanks to all the scabs who have already crossed(not nearly 1000 by the way).most of you are to stupid to realize its not the money,its the split shifts and the loss of eto.a lot of you hired in after 8/96 so this means if we don't fight this contract,your life will be hawker beech on friday,saturday and sunday. three 12 hour days with no o.t. say goodbye to spending time with your family. don't worry though keep getting your check and the rest of us will fight the fight for you. by the way,all of you who did cross will definately be treated way different when we get back to work.so